Author Topic: Paddles :D  (Read 6963 times)

Offline canoekev

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Paddles :D
« on: May 02, 2014, 19:44:03 »
Guys does anyone have any recommendations/tips for paddles?  I'm just looking at the moment but would like to get a decent set some time in the future. From paddles I've tried I prefer them with less feather, plus I'd like to get more into playboating.. Also do good polo - whitewater paddles exist?

The absolute most I'd be willing to spend would be 250 but they'd have to be perfect (and brand new). Any ideas or even things to avoid? And is it better to go a bit longer or shorter or does it matter?

(I dont mind second hand.. so long as they're not in bits)

Offline DervM

  • Posts: 1,166
Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2014, 20:00:41 »
http://wernerpaddles.com/fit_guide_widget/

This is a really helpful resource. Also I like Werner paddles so would recommend them anyway. ATs are the other current popular brand but they do tend to be a bit heavier than Werners and often can be more pricy for your first paddle - more in the region of €350 than €220.

Tips: get shaft length, blades, and feather to do you for both freestyle and river-running. So probably 197cm, mid-size blades, and a 30o or 45o feather. Don't get too long or short (some people recommend shorter for freestyle, but I haven't heard that as much recently, and it makes them less useful for rivers). Don't get big blades like Powerhouses unless you know your shoulders can handle them.

Don't know about any good polo-whitewater blades as even polo blades break often. And they're made for it.

Offline Peter O'Sullivan

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2014, 20:19:05 »
Next time you're on the water ask to try other peoples' paddles. Try as many as you can. Find what you like.

Offline canoekev

  • Posts: 54
Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2014, 20:27:18 »
it gave me sherpa (194cm) which is actually what I've been leaning towards for a while. I tried Nialls AT's a few weeks ago, they were nice but I think i prefer werner. (They might just have been too big) also forgot to mention that I'm about 5'8.

Offline Steven Mul

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2014, 23:11:11 »
Ye I'd say stay away from powerhouses unless you feel you've a good powerful stroke. I like my 30° feather compared to a 45°. Try people's paddles and get a feel for what you like. I'm not mad on ATs but others love them. Sherpas sound like a good call for you.

Offline Diarmuid

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2014, 23:57:45 »
Try all the paddles, every shape, size, length, brand, model and material you can get your hands on.
If you like some, try them again.
If you still like them try find out about their general reliability for not breaking and shit (ask people, Google, etc).
If they still look good i think there's a pretty decent chance they'll suit you.

Offline Zog

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2014, 01:10:22 »
I'd just like to stress to take your time in the whole process and don't feel rushed into the decision, i was looking for paddles since last summer and I only got mine at Christmas, but I got a really good deal! What's for you won't go by you and like Diarmuid said, try everything you can. :)

Offline canoekev

  • Posts: 54
Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2014, 11:51:34 »
Diarmuid do you have rough stuff paddles? Does anyone know have they gone out of business? Also what brand are the 'good' club paddles.. you know the black ones that are fairly banged up

Offline Aoife S

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #8 on: May 11, 2014, 11:56:22 »
Yup Diarmuid has RoughStuff, yep they've close down and  yep they're rough stuff if I'm thinking o the same ones as you :)

As far as I know there's only a certain generation of RS paddles worth getting because the rest have shafts that break very easily...the older the paddle the better as far as I know :)

Offline Diarmuid

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #9 on: May 11, 2014, 13:39:23 »
Rough stuff no longer exist.

You can usually pick them up a decent bit cheaper than other second hand paddles though.

Some types of rough stuff are inclined to break a bit easier than the average paddle. But I feel like the ones that are are probably already broken this stage so you probably won't come across them.

My rough stuff's are bomber. As are most others I hear of.

Adventure Technology seem yo be getting a few returns recently. That said they seem to be pretty good at replacing, though the replacements are not always good either apparently (eh Andrew? ).
« Last Edit: May 11, 2014, 13:41:30 by Diarmuid »

Offline Conor Mohan

  • Posts: 218
Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2014, 13:57:21 »
I paid €30.00 for my rough stuffs, which is the price you'd expect to pay for club paddles. I waited for a good deal to come up on the canoes & kayaks page.
They're extremely well worn, and look it too; but they're still a massive difference from club paddles.
Anything you get will probably be an improvement over club paddles.

Offline Douchier

  • Posts: 360
Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2014, 14:50:06 »

Rough Stuff:
As far as I know there's only a certain generation of RS paddles worth getting because the rest have shafts that break very easily...the older the paddle the better as far as I know :)
Well...there's a bit more to it than that.


This is the reason that Mark(the person in question) gave for the business going belly-up. The truth is that he's a nice guy and made some of the best paddles that you could get 10+ years ago. Unfortunately he had some issues in life. This effected how well he was able to run the business, and ultimately the quality and consistency of the paddles, on an ongoing basis. It's sad, but it's life. The business has been semi-closed for about 5 years and last year he decided to close shop and move to Australia. I get the impression that he's been doing better for the last while, but really, what the fuck do I know about the guy's life.


TL:DR - there's no real pattern to their production quality.


Rough Stuff paddles now?

The good:
What he was best at was designing paddles. IMHO blade shapes of the paddles are nice to use and compare well to what's around at the moment.


The less good:
They haven't changed in ~15 years. Compared to modern paddles, they're quite heavy. Many/most? of the black "carbon" paddles have very little carbon in them and thus don't have any of the weight or strength advantage. Even the paddles that were well made are getting quite old at this stage and increasingly likely to break (this is true of anything made out of composites, that gets used).

Buying them?
Are they cheap?Go for it!


I'll assume that you're talking about spending €50-80 (I wouldn't pay more than that for rough-stuff)?
What's the worst that can happen?


Two things are likely to happen:


1. You break them, probably about a year from now, you'll have learned lots, had a proper feel of what a decent set of paddles feel like and you haven't spent too much. Your first set of paddles are always going to be the ones that you're most likely to break.


2. You decide that you want a different set. You haven't spent much on them so you' won't lose much (you may even get all of your money back). Happy Days.



Buying your first set of paddles?
My personal advice is not to worry so much. Most paddles are good paddles, most are reasonably priced.
There's lots of different paddles out there, but as a newer paddler you haven't really developed much of a style yet and you won't really know what suits, because nothing really does. Whichever paddles you buy, you'll adapt to and enjoy.


If buying new, some paddles are terrible and shouldn't be bought. most are good.


If buying second-hand, most things are worth buying at the right price, so long as they're noticeably better than club paddles. Some will last you longer than others.


Notes on Rough Stuff:
1.My first two proper sets of paddles were rough-stuff. I broke both of them. Both of them broke too easily. One of them was the supposedly good vintage. I liked both of them, I don't regret buying either.
FYI: I had a set of Tempests and a set of Black-Magics.

2. He made A LOT of different blade shapes. He liked to design and experiment.

3. He also liked to experiment with materials, this is why a lot of the "carbon" paddles aren't that carbony - he used a lot of mixes in an attempt to give the consumer an affordable "carbon" paddle.

4.The main Rough-Stuff white-water paddles you'll find are Tempests and Kinetics.
Tempests have a traditional-asymmetric  blade shape and Kinetics, oddly enough have a kinetic shape.

5. The blades are usually joined to the shaft with a big chunk of aluminium. This means that they're all heavy, all of them.



Specifics about paddles?
If anyone would like to ask about the details of paddles then feel free to ask. The difference that different blade shapes, paddles length, materials, manufacturer etc. make is interesting...but for buying your first set of paddles it's probably completely irrelevant.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2014, 14:52:15 by Douchier »

Offline Douchier

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2014, 15:41:03 »


ATs ...tend to be a bit heavier than Werners
I'm thinking this is a reference to the former mid-range line(white blades with black shafts)?

If so then you'd be totally right, they were terrible. Thankfully they've been discontinued.

They were really heavy, excessively flexible and really, really overpriced.

They've been replaced by a new mid-range line which are very similar to the mid-range Werners. Build is identical and blade shapes are similar, but a little less expreme( ie. the Geronimo is a little less traditional shaped than the Powerhouse and the Samauri is a little less extremely kinetic than the Player).


Prices are slightly cheaper than the mid-range Werners.
(Comparing AT Eddies to Werner Players isn't a fair price comparison as they're a very different construction)

Adventure Technology seem yo be getting a few returns recently.
This seems to be a bit of a problem. But luckily seems limited to the connecting spigot. I'm guessing that whatever glue they're using just isn't up to scratch. It might be best to just factor in an extra few euro for a tube of epoxy. Everything else on them is very durable.


The white ones that Andrew got were end-of-line and aren't made any more.


it gave me sherpa (194cm) which is actually what I've been leaning towards for a while.


I have to say, I think that app is a load of shite.
The length is a no-brainer and the rest is just fitting you into whichever marketing bracket they want to put you.
It pushes the fallacious notion that traditional-asymmetric shape paddles (Sherpas, Powerhouses, shoguns, stikines etc.) are the better/the only paddles for river-running. Codswollop.


Of course, they're still good paddles and would be suitable.


I tried Nialls AT's a few weeks ago, they were nice but I think i prefer werner. (They might just have been too big) also forgot to mention that I'm about 5'8.

Maybe worth keeping in mind that you're comparing very different blade shapes too.

Offline DervM

  • Posts: 1,166
Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2014, 15:49:41 »
They've been replaced by a new mid-range line which are very similar to the mid-range Werners. Build is identical and blade shapes are similar, but a little less expreme( ie. the Geronimo is a little less traditional shaped than the Powerhouse and the Samauri is a little less extremely kinetic than the Player).

Oh yeah! Forgot these came out. The marketing video on the composite they're using (Innegra) for these made me really interested, but haven't seen them out on a river yet to have a look.

Offline Douchier

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Re: Paddles :D
« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2014, 16:09:09 »
For some reason I don't think many shops are stocking them. Weird.